Nomination Ideas--CATCHER IMPROVEMENTS

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egvrich

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Re: Nomination Ideas--CATCHER IMPROVEMENTS

PostMon May 09, 2022 7:54 pm

I would argue that his rating would also be really out of context ... :lol: :lol:

I was thinking that maybe they combined all of the "other" guys who caught that year and lumped their stats on top of Rudolph's stats, but that kinda stinks for poor old Kenny Rudolph.
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egvrich

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Re: Nomination Ideas--CATCHER IMPROVEMENTS

PostMon May 09, 2022 8:18 pm

Wowsers, the Cubs had 5 different catchers in 1971
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southpawcom

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Re: Nomination Ideas--CATCHER IMPROVEMENTS

PostSat Jun 18, 2022 7:59 pm

Frankie Hayes, 1944. (The set has his '36 year.)

Having played 155 games in a 154-game season, "Blimp" Hayes would become, I believe, our first and only bulletproof catcher. Consider the strategic, roster-construction implications of that for just a moment.

Solid defense on the '44 season, and his .248/.315/.367 should make his salary among backstops about what 1915 Dave Bancroft's is among shortstops.

Hayes was a 6-time All Star!
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southpawcom

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Re: Nomination Ideas--CATCHER IMPROVEMENTS

PostSat Jun 18, 2022 8:28 pm

Mike Lieberthal, 2003.

Rated as E vs both hands of pitching, his .313/.373./453 slash line is more playable than his 31-HR, 5L 1999 season already in the set. With a 14-year career and 1,170 games behind the plate, Lieby deserves more than one card.

https://365.strat-o-matic.com/player/655/1700/1/120
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southpawcom

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Re: Nomination Ideas--CATCHER IMPROVEMENTS

PostFri Oct 21, 2022 9:25 pm

Buck Ewing (https://www.baseball-reference.com/play ... bu01.shtml) is in the Hall of Fame and has one card in ATG (https://365.strat-o-matic.com/player/33 ... 292/462030). It has Ewing eligible at 1B only.

The problem is Ewing was primarily a catcher and one of the greatest. He was the New York Giants' regular catcher throughout the 1880s, was admitted to the HOF when it opened in 1939, and was cited as "baseball's best catcher and, according to his contemporaries, was unequaled as an all-around player in the 19th century." ("The Ballplayers," edited by Mike Shatzkin, William Morrow & Company, 1990). David Nemec, author of Ewing's SABR bio (https://sabr.org/bioproj/person/Buck-Ewing/), states: "Connie Mack deemed the sinewy 5-foot-10-inch and 188-pound Ewing the greatest catcher of all-time. Francis Richter, editor of Sporting Life and the Reach Guide, was even more laudatory in 1919, listing Ewing with Ty Cobb and Honus Wagner as the game’s three top stars to that point.”

A lifetime .303 hitter whose career was almost a century and a half ago, Ewing still appears on Top 10 lists for seasonal offensive statistics a very surprising number of times. For example, in 1884 he hit 20 Triples, and in four other seasons he hit 15. They happen to be the top five all-time season totals for three-baggers among catchers.

Also, the all-time leader in Runs Scored in a single season among backstops is Mickey Cochrane with 118. But second on the list is Ewing with 117.

Finally, my favorite -- Ewing's name appears in 5 of the top 6 places on the list of most Stolen Bases in a season by a catcher, with totals of 53, 47, 42, 41, and 39. Roger Bresnahan's 1903 card has the only AA steal rating in the set for a player with catcher as his primary position. Take your pick of Ewing seasons for the next one.

You might be thinking, "oh, those are 19th century player statistics, for sure," and you'd be right. But Ewing also hit with enough authority to drive in 122 runs one season, which, at least according to one source, still is among the Top 10 all-time RBI seasons for a catcher. (source: https://members.tripod.com/bb_catchers/ ... asonld.htm)

Defensively, Ewing's stats seem to put him above or well above league averages in Fielding Pct. most seasons. According to his SABR bio (https://sabr.org/bioproj/person/Buck-Ewing/), he innovated the "pillow mitt" for catchers. But I can't guess how his defense would translate to Strat-O-Matic ratings.

Ewing's problem in ATG might be that he seems to have distributed his big offensive numbers among different seasons, so it might be challenging to find the one season that represents adequately his undisputable greatness. But I think he makes his case that he deserves an improved card, this time as a catcher.
Last edited by southpawcom on Sat Oct 22, 2022 9:47 am, edited 1 time in total.
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andycummings65

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Re: Nomination Ideas--CATCHER IMPROVEMENTS

PostFri Oct 21, 2022 9:58 pm

1890 might be the best overall year for him.
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ScumbyJr

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Re: Nomination Ideas--CATCHER IMPROVEMENTS

PostFri Oct 28, 2022 8:51 am

southpawcom wrote:Frankie Hayes, 1944. (The set has his '36 year.)

Having played 155 games in a 154-game season, "Blimp" Hayes would become, I believe, our first and only bulletproof catcher. Consider the strategic, roster-construction implications of that for just a moment.

Solid defense on the '44 season, and his .248/.315/.367 should make his salary among backstops about what 1915 Dave Bancroft's is among shortstops.

Hayes was a 6-time All Star!


Would he be bulletproof? Mike Tresh started all 150 games in 1945, but is an Inj 2.
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andycummings65

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Re: Nomination Ideas--CATCHER IMPROVEMENTS

PostFri Oct 28, 2022 10:15 am

ScumbyJr wrote:
southpawcom wrote:Frankie Hayes, 1944. (The set has his '36 year.)

Having played 155 games in a 154-game season, "Blimp" Hayes would become, I believe, our first and only bulletproof catcher. Consider the strategic, roster-construction implications of that for just a moment.

Solid defense on the '44 season, and his .248/.315/.367 should make his salary among backstops about what 1915 Dave Bancroft's is among shortstops.

Hayes was a 6-time All Star!


Would he be bulletproof? Mike Tresh started all 150 games in 1945, but is an Inj 2.


From looking at the card, he’d be a 1 Injury rating, with a 15 game Injury chance.
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southpawcom

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Re: Nomination Ideas--CATCHER IMPROVEMENTS

PostMon Oct 31, 2022 10:17 am

andycummings65 wrote:
ScumbyJr wrote:
southpawcom wrote:Frankie Hayes, 1944. (The set has his '36 year.)

Having played 155 games in a 154-game season, "Blimp" Hayes would become, I believe, our first and only bulletproof catcher. Consider the strategic, roster-construction implications of that for just a moment.

Solid defense on the '44 season, and his .248/.315/.367 should make his salary among backstops about what 1915 Dave Bancroft's is among shortstops.

Hayes was a 6-time All Star!


Would he be bulletproof? Mike Tresh started all 150 games in 1945, but is an Inj 2.


From looking at the card, he’d be a 1 Injury rating, with a 15 game Injury chance.



I do not get it, given the stats, or understand why, but I have concluded that S-O-M indeed would never card a bulletproof catcher.
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muellerinwesttn

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Re: Nomination Ideas--CATCHER IMPROVEMENTS

PostWed Nov 09, 2022 6:03 pm

Wouldn't Gene Tenace's 1977 card or 1982 card be better than the 1975 card?

In the 1977 card set he's a real force. He led the league in walks and hbp that year. Defense is spotty like always, but also plays 1b and 3b. In 1982 he played limited time with the Cardinals championship team. Had an OBP of 436.

There's also the limited use card for 1971. He's 23 and catcher only, but had a 992 OPS.

He was a walk machine, playing 893 games at catcher and 627 at first base, and finished with 46.8 WAR.
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