Pre War Outfielders-- Improvement Edition

Discussion for new cards to add; moderated by Rosie2167

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andycummings65

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Re: Pre War Outfielders-- Improvement Edition

PostFri Mar 15, 2019 10:47 pm

I’ll post some Roush numbers soon. Been on vacation
Last edited by andycummings65 on Sun Mar 17, 2019 4:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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andycummings65

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Re: Pre War Outfielders-- Improvement Edition

PostSun Mar 17, 2019 4:09 pm

Outta Leftfield wrote:
djp_77 wrote:Edd Roush 1923 1921

I agree that it would be great to get a better Edd Roush card than the one we have.
Here's what OPS+ at baseball-reference.com shows for some potential cards. A lot are pretty close. If we knew which one was actually the best SOM card, we could nominate that. In terms of plain old OPS, 1921 and 1923 are clearly the best years, but we can't be sure how much is SOM adjusting for the hitting environment. The years with the highest OPS+ are deadfall era. Some candidates for Roush:

Year: OPS+
1917: 159
1918: 151 (best in league)
1919: 146
1920: 141
1921: 143
1923: 148
1925: 125 (only current card)
Any of the years listed before 1925 would likely be a significant improvement. So, Andy, if you can guide us toward which year might actually make the best SOM card, or give us a couple of choices, that would be most welcome.


1917 Edd Roush, CIN, Bats-L, 1R Balance, CF/LF/RF-1(-2)e16, Steal: *4-6,12/- (18-13), 15 game INJ risk
LH--3.3 2b, 3.6 3b, 1 HR, 3 BB 426/448/556, 1.003 OPS
RH--3.5 2b, 3.9 3b, 1 HR, 3 BB 457/477/594, 1.071 OPS
Led League in Batting Average

1918 Edd Roush, CIN, Bats-L, 1R Balance, CF-1(-2)e19, Steal: *4-6,12/- (18-13), 15 game INJ risk
LH--4.5 2b, 3 3b,1.5 HR, 2 BB 405/421/548, .969 OPS
RH-- 4.8 2b, 3.3 3b, 1.8 HR, 2 BB 435/451/593, 1.044 OPS

1919 Edd Roush, CIN, Bats-L, 1R Balance, CF-1(-2)e5, Steal: *4-6,12/- (18-13), 15 game INJ risk
LH--3.2 2b, 3 3b, 0.8 HR, 9 BB 370/429/489, .917 OPS
RH--3.6 2b, 3.3 3b, 1.1 HR, 9 BB 417/471/554, 1.025 OPS
Led League in Batting Average

1920 Edd Roush, CIN, Bats-L, 1R Balance, CF/LF-1(-2)e6, 1b-3e28, 2b-5e71, Steal: *2-10/11,12(15-11), 3 game INJ risk
LH--3.5 2b, 2.2 3b, 0.8 HR, 4 BB 403/431/501, .932 OPS
RH--3.3 2b, 4.8 3b, 0.5 HR, 7 BB 405/449/547, .996 OPS

1921 Edd Roush, CIN, Bats-L, 1R Balance, CF/LF/RF-1(-2)e8, Steal: *4-6,12/- (18-13), 15 game INJ risk
LH--6.8 2b, 3.8 3b, 0.8 HR, 7 BB 382/428/550, .978 OPS
RH--8 2b, 4.2 3b, 1 HR, 7 BB 443/485/638, 1.122 OPS

1923 Edd Roush, CIN, Bats-L, E Balance, CF/LF/RF-1(-2)e12, Steal: *4-6/- (17-12), 15 game INJ risk
LH--9.6 2b, 5.3 3b, 1 HR, 8 BB 400/450/634, 1.084 OPS
RH--10 2b, 5.6 3b, 1.3 HR, 8 BB 415/464/667, 1.131 OPS
Led League in Doubles

Current 1925 Roush, 6.42m, CIN, Bats-L, E Balance, CF/LF/RF-1(-2)e6, Steal: *4-6,12/- (18-13)
LH--5 2b, 4.8 3b, 2.2 HR, 4 BB 410/437/614, 1.051 OPS
RH--5 2b, 4.5 3b, 2.2 HR, 4 BB 401/429/601, 1.030 OPS

I think it's 1923. The XBH are strong in the 23 card. 1921 & 1917 have a little nicer OBP vs RHP, but I think it's negligible.
Steal rating is a little worse in 1923. I think my 2nd choice would be 1917.
1917 gives the db Reds a good CF, but, if you're looking for best card, it's 1923.

And Roush was very consistent, so giving him his best card is not like giving George Watkins HIS best card.
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andycummings65

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Re: Pre War Outfielders-- Improvement Edition

PostSun Mar 17, 2019 11:03 pm

djp_77 wrote:Paul Waner 1928 1936
Lloyd Waner 1929
Vince Dimaggio 1940
Dom Dimaggio 1940 (probably wouldn't be his best card but it should be for all outfield positions and I would like a all Dimaggio outfield)
Al Simmons 1927 1931
Roy Cullenbine 1941
Jeff Heath 1938


1928 Paul Waner, PIT, Bats-L, E Balance, RF/LF-1(-2)e9, CF-2(-)e9, 1b-2e25
LH--10.2 2b, 4.8 3b, 0.9 HR, 14 BB 492/563/733, 1.296 OPS
RH--10 2b, 4.8 3b, 1 HR, 14 BB 485/556/728, 1.284 OPS
Led League in Doubles and Runs

1936 Paul Waner, PIT, Bats-L, E Balance, RF/LF-1(-2)e14, CF-2(-2)e14
LH--11 2b, 1.8 3b, 0.5 HR, 15 BB 461/541/636, 1.177 OPS
RH--11.4 2b, 2 3b, 0.7 HR, 15 BB 480/557/671, 1.228 OPS
Led League in Batting Average. 5th in MVP Voting.

Current 1927 Paul Waner, 9.45m, PIT, Bats-L, 2L Balance, RF-1(-3)e5, 1b-3e24
LH-- 8 2b, 6.2 3b, 2.6 HR, 7 BB 496/533/777, 1.310 OPS
RH--7.8 2b, 3.3 3b, 1.7 HR, 9 BB 450/501/649, 1.150 OPS
Led League in Hits, Triples, RBI, and Batting Average. Voted NL MVP.

Current 1934 Paul Waner, 7.85m, PIT, Bats-L, 2R Balance, RF-1(-3)e4
LH--3.1 2b, 3.4 3b, 2.8 HR, 11 BB 401/468/591, 1.059 OPS
RH--5.6 2b, 4.3 3b, 3 HR, 10 BB 458/513/694, 1.206 OPS
Led League in Hits, Runs, and Batting Average. 2nd in MVP Voting.

It's funny, Waner was probably a little better in 1928 than in 1927, yet he finished 15th in MVP in 1928 after winning in 1927. Of course, the Pirates dropped to 4th in 1928 and Waner's RBI total dropped by almost 50 in 1928.
1928 is clearly better than 1936. 1928 appears better to me than the current 1927 as well. Also, 1928 gives options to play all OF spots and 1b. That said, it's not that different than 1927. I wouldn't at all mind it being added, but others I'd want first, since Waner is well-represented.





1929 Lloyd Waner, PIT, Bats-L, E Balance, CF/LF/RF-1(-1)e6
LH--3 2b, 4.8 3b, 0.2 HR, 2 BB 442/458/567, 1.025 OPS
RH--3 2b, 4.8 3b, 0.2 HR, 2 BB 435/451/560, 1.011 OPS
Led League in Doubles, 5th in MVP Voting.

Current 1927 Lloyd Waner, 5.52m, PIT, 1L Balance, CF/LF/RF-1(-1)e7, 2b-4e26, Steal: *6,7/- (15-11)
LH--0 2b, 0.5 3b, 0 HR, 1 BB 476/491/486, .977 OPS
RH--1 2b, 0.6 3b, 0.8 HR, 3 BB 421/448/464, .912 OPS
Led League in Runs, finished 6th in MVP Voting (Paul won).

Current 1928 Lloyd Waner, 5.71 PIT, PIT, E Balance, CF/LF/RF-1(-1)e6
LH--1.8 2b, 3 3b, 0.5 HR, 3 BB 413/435/502, .937 OPS
RH--1.8 2b, 3.3 3b, 0.4 HR,3 BB 427/449/519, .968 OPS

The only thing the 1929 card would add would be a bump in 2b and 3b. I just think another Little Poison card just clutters the set. Paul was a first class Hall of Famer, Lloyd was not.




1940 Dom DiMaggio, BOS, Bats-R, 1L Balance, CF/LF/RF-1(-3)e11
LH--9.9 2b, 1.8 3b, 2.3 HR, 8 BB 383/434/587, 1.021 OPS
RH--8.5 2b, 1.6 3b, 1.8 HR, 8 BB 332/388/503, .891 OPS

Current 1946 Dom DiMaggio, 6.30m, BOS, Bats-R, E Balance, CF-1(-3)e5
LH--3.8 2b, 1.5 3b, 1.1 HR, 13 BB 388/468/496, .964 OPS
RH--3.9 2b, 1.6 3b, 1 HR, 13 BB 381/461/488, .949 OPS

1940 adds a few more doubles, though less OBP than 1946. The aforementioned availability at all 3 OF spots is the only reason I'd consider 1940 even a little bit.

If you want to add another Dom, how about:
1950 Dom DiMaggio, BOS, Bats-R, 2L Balance, CF-1(-3)e8
LH--7.7 2b, 1.6 3b, 1.8 HR, 12 BB 439/512/611, 1.123 OPS
RH--3.5 2b, 3 3b, 0.5 HR, 17 BB 351/465/475, .940 OPS
Led League in Runs and Triples




1940 Vince DiMaggio, PIT, Bats-R, 1L Balance, CF/RF/RF-1(-3)e7
LH--9.3 2b, 0 3b,12 HR, 11 BB 385/454/857, 1.311 OPS
RH--8.3 2b, 0 3b, 9 HR, 11 BB 326/400/693, 1.093 OPS

Current Vince DiMaggio, 2.74m, PIT, Bats-R, E Balance, CF/RF/RF-1(-3)e9
LH--4.2 2b, 0.5 3b, 6.6 HR, 10 BB 222/301/480, .781 OPS
RH--4.2 2b, 0.5 3b, 6.3 HR, 10 BB 214/294/462, .756 OPS
He's ok, cheaper source of power at 3 good defensive spots.




1927 Al Simmons, PHA, Bats-R, 2R Balance, LF-1(-3)e6, CF-2(-3)e6
LH-- 18.2 2b, 0 3b, 6.4 HR, 2 BB 463/473/816, 1.289 OPS
RH--9.8 2b, 5.7 3b, 7.1 HR, 6 BB 521/547/935, 1.483 OPS
Finished 4th in MVP Voting

1931 Al Simmons, PHA, Bats-R, 1L Balance, LF-1(-1)e5, CF-2(-3)e5
LH-- 8.3 2b, 3.9 3b, 7.3 HR, 8 BB 528/567/911, 1.478 OPS
RH--7.8 2b, 3.6 3b, 6.8 HR, 8 BB 499/541/857, 1.398 OPS
Led League in Batting Average, finished 3rd in MVP Voting.

Current 1925 Simmons, 8.85m, PHA, Bats-R, E Balance, RF/LF-1(-1)e10, CF-2(-1)e10
LH--7.5 2b, 2.4 3b, 5.9 HR, 1 BB 499/508/782, 1.290 OPS
RH--7.3 2b, 2.4 3b, 5.7 HR, 1 BB 487/497/762, 1.259 OPS
Led League in Hits and Total Bases, 2nd in MVP Voting.

Current 1929 Simmons, 9.73m, PHA, Bats-R, E Balance, RF/LF-1(-1)e3, CF-2(-1)e3
LH--8.3 2b, 1.8 3b, 10.1 HR, 1 BB 465/475/862, 1.337 OPS
RH--8.3 2b, 1.8 3b, 10 HR, 1 BB 459/469/853, 1.322 OPS
Led League in RBI and Total Bases.

Current 1930 Simmons, 10.58m, PHA, Bats-R, 1L Balance, LF-1(-4)e3, CF-2(-4)e3
LH--10.8 2b, 0.5 3b, 13.2 HR, 11 BB 512/562/1.041, 1.603 OPS
RH--8.5 2b, 5 3b, 11 HR, 4 BB 469/488/964, 1.452 OPS
Led league in Runs and Batting Average.

Dude could HIT. 1927 provides a 2R Balance that would be probably his best card vs RHP, though the current 1930 card is almost as good vs RHP, and that's not 1930's strong side. I mean, there are some really great numbers here. Are they really a lot different than what we already have? Not really.




1941 Roy Cullenbine, SLB, Bats-S, E Balance, LF-2(+1)e13, RF-3(+1)e13, CF-4(+1)e13, 1b-4e29
LH--6.6 2b, 0 3b, 3.5 HR, 37 BB 357/583/599, 1.182 OPS
RH--4.1 2b, 2.7 3b, 0.8 HR, 26 BB 381/536/525, 1.061 OPS

Current 1943 Cullenbine, 4.35m, CLE, Bats-S, E Balance, RF/LF-2(+1)e6, CF-3(+1)e6, 1b-4e20
LH--4.5 2b, 0.6 3b, 2.6 HR, 24 BB 330/485/492, .977 OPS
RH--4.3 2b, 0.6 3b, 2.4 HR, 24 BB 312/471/463, .934 OPS

Walked a lot. 1941 is better than current card. He never approached those 1941 numbers again. Good OBP, but not good speed (13). Not terrible...…not great.....



1938 Jeff Heath, CLE, Bats-L, 7R Balance, LF/RF-3(+1)e9
LH--3.2 2b, 1.8 3b, 0.6 HR, 0 BB 284/284/363, 647 OPS
RH--8.2 2b, 7.2 3b, 9.8 HR, 4 BB 448/468/948, 1.416 OPS

Current 1941 Heath, 4.84m, CLE, Bats-L, 6R Balance, LF/RF-4(0)e14
LH--0 2b, 2.8 3b, 2.8 HR, 7 BB 294/353/435, .788 OPS
RH--8.3 2b, 6.3 3b, 7.5 HR, 4 BB 438/469/862, 1.331 OPS

Second verse, just like the first. This would be a redundant card IMO, though his defense is slightly better.
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djp_77

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Re: Pre War Outfielders-- Improvement Edition

PostMon Apr 01, 2019 2:31 pm

Gee Walker 36 37
Morrie Arnovich 37 39
Terry Moore 39 40
Wally Moses 36 37
Freddy Leach 26 30
Charlie Jamieson 23 24
Hank Leiber 35 39
Irish Meusel 21 22 25
Bob Meusel 21 25
Pete Fox 35 37
Ival Goodman 38 39
Max Carey 25
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andycummings65

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Re: Pre War Outfielders-- Improvement Edition

PostThu Apr 04, 2019 4:31 pm

djp_77 wrote:Gee Walker 36 37
Morrie Arnovich 37 39
Terry Moore 39 40
Wally Moses 36 37
Freddy Leach 26 30
Charlie Jamieson 23 24
Hank Leiber 35 39
Irish Meusel 21 22 25
Bob Meusel 21 25
Pete Fox 35 37
Ival Goodman 38 39
Max Carey 25


1936 Gee Walker, DET, Bats-R, E Balance, LF/CF/RF-3(0)e19, 15 Game INJ Risk
LH--13.5 2b, 0.6 3b, 3 HR, 0 BB 424/430/646, 1.075 OPS
RH--13.2 2b, 0.8 3b, 3.1 HR, 0 BB 418/424/643, 1.066 OPS

1937 Gee Walker, DET, Bats-R, E Balance, LF/CF/RF-3(0)e15, Steal: *4-6,12/-(18-13), In Game INJ Risk only
LH—7.5 2b, 0.3 3b, 4.8 HR, 2 BB 404/421/617, 1.038 OPS
RH--7.3 2b, 0.3 3b, 4.8 HR, 2 BB 396/413/607, 1.020 OPS

Current 1933 Walker, .90m, DET, Bats-R, E Balance, LF/RF/CF-3(0)e15
LH--6.8 2b, 1.8 3b, 2.7 HR, 0 BB 304/311/476, .787 OPS
RH--6.6 2b, 1.7 3b, 2.6 HR, 0 BB 298/304/463, .767 OPS

A two time Tiger World Series player with a 15 year career, a better card would be ok. I’m partial to the 1937 card with a little more power, better steal rating, and a little better defense (though none of his defense is that good)





1937 Morrie Arnovich, PHI, Bats-R, 1L Balance, LF-3(+1)e10, RF/CF-4(+1)e10, 15 Game INJ Risk
LH— 8 2b, 1 3b, 3 HR, 7 BB 333/382/523, .904 OPS
RH-- 7.4 2b, 0.9 3b, 2.7 HR, 7 BB 306/357/477, .834 OPS

1939 Morrie Arnovich, PHI, Bats-R, E Balance, LF-3(+1)e7, RF/CF-4(+1)e7, 15 Game INJ Risk
LH— 4.6 2b, 0 3b, 0.5 HR, 13 BB 394/472/459, .931 OPS
RH-- 4.4 2b, 0 3b, 0.5 HR, 13 BB 385/465/448, .913 OPS

Current 1940 Arnovich, .52m, CIN, Bats-R, 1L Balance, LF-3(+1)e7
LH— 2.3 2b, 0.8 3b, 0 HR, 6 BB 285/331/323, .654 OPS
RH--2 2b, 0.8 3b, 0 HR, 6 BB 245/294/280, .574 OPS

Obviously an improvement on a .52m scrub card, Arnovich was a starter for two seasons. I don’t think the set is crying out for a Morrie Arnovich card.





1939 Terry Moore, STL, Bats-R, E Balance, CF/LF/RF-1(0)e2, 15 Game INJ Risk
LH-- 6.2 2b, 0 3b, 7.3 HR, 10 BB 332/400/622, 1.022 OPS
RH-- 6.2 2b, 0 3b, 7.3 HR, 10 BB 328/397/616, 1.013 OPS

1940 Terry Moore, STL, Bats-R, E Balance, CF/LF/RF-1(0)e6, Steal: *4-6,12/-(18-13), 15 Game INJ Risk
LH— 7.2 2b, 0.5 3b, 5.5 HR, 6 BB 378/419/623, 1.041 OPS
RH-- 6.8 2b, 0.5 3b, 5.2 HR, 6 BB 360/402/592, .994 OPS

Current 1941 Moore, 5.70m, STL, Bats-R, 1L Balance, CF-1(-4)e6, 15 Game INJ Risk
LH— 7.3 2b, 1.8 3b, 3.3 HR, 8 BB 329/385/537, .822 OPS
RH—5 2b, 0.4 3b, 0.8 HR, 13 BB 333/419/419, .838 OPS

As the starting CFer for the mid 30s to mid 40s, Terry Moore was a nice part of a lot of good Cardinals teams. Either card would be an improvement; I’m kind of partial to the one with more HR power and good defense at all 3 OF spots, 1939.





1936 Wally Moses, PHA, Bats-L, E Balance, RF-2(0)e11, CF-3(0)e11, LF-4(0)e11, 3 Game INJ Risk
LH— 5.6 2b, 2.5 3b, 0.4 HR, 9 BB 424/478/545, 1.023 OPS
RH-- 5.6 2b, 2.5 3b, 0.4 HR, 9 BB 424/478/545, 1.023 OPS
14th in MVP Voting.

1937 Wally Moses PHA, Bats-L, E Balance, RF-2(0)e15, CF-3(0)e15, LF-4(0)e15, In Game INJ Risk ONLY
LH— 8.4 2b, 2.8 3b, 5.5 HR, 5 BB 381/416/679, 1.095 OPS
RH-- 8.7 2b, 2.8 3b, 5.5 HR, 5 BB 392/425/693, 1.119 OPS
11th in MVP Voting.

Current 1945 Moses, 2.80m, CWS, Bats-L, E Balance, RF-2(0)e9, LF/CF-3(0)e9, 3 Game INJ Risk
LH—7 2b, 4.2 3b, 0 HR, 13 BB 328/415/491, .906 OPS
RH—7 2b, 4.2 3b, 0 HR, 13 BB 324/412/488, .900 OPS

It’s funny how World War 2 had such an effect on baseball. Wally Moses and Bob Johnson were the best hitters on some terrible A’s clubs, and from 1935-1941, Moses slashed 317/384/464 with an .848 OPS. Then, World War 2 happened, but, for Moses, instead of improving on his stats facing worse pitching, his batting skills got worse. Anyway, he’s one of the players who deserves better representation, and an A’s card as well. That 1937 card has some HR power, though 1936 isn’t too bad either.






1926 Freddy Leach, PHI, Bats-L, E Balance, LF/RF-3(-1)e9, CF-4(-1)e9, 15 Game INJ Risk
LH—6.6 2b, 1.5 3b, 2.5 HR, 0 BB 386/392/546, .937 OPS
RH-- 6.6 2b, 1.5 3b, 2.5 HR, 0 BB 394/400/554, .954 OPS

1930 Freddy Leach, NYG, Bats-L, 6R Balance, LF -3(+1)e7, 1b-4e25, 15 Game INJ Risk
LH—4.2 2b, 4.8 3b, 0 HR, 0 BB 091/117/223, .340 OPS
RH--0.6 2b, 2.8 3b, 3.3 HR, 0 BB 361/379/514, .893 OPS

Current 1928 Leach, 2.80m, PHI, Bats-L, E Balance, LF/RF-3(-1)e6, CF-4(-1)e6, 1b-4e15, 3 Game INJ Risk
LH-- 6.9 2b, 2.6 3b, 2.2 HR, 1 BB 338/350/513, .863 OPS
RH--6.9 2b, 2.6 3b, 2.2 HR, 1 BB 338/350/513, .863 OPS

I don’t see much reason to make an add.






1923 Charlie Jamieson, CLE, Bats-L, E Balance, LF/CF/RF-2(0)e10, 3 Game INJ Risk
LH—5.3 2b, 2.3 3b, 0 HR, 13 BB 456/526/560, 1.086 OPS
RH--5.3 2b, 2.3 3b, 0 HR, 13 BB 447/519/552, 1.071 OPS
Led League in Hits. 6th in MVP Voting.

1924 Charlie Jamieson, CLE, Bats-L, 1L Balance, LF-2(0)e11, 3 Game INJ Risk
LH—11.5 2b, 1 3b, 1.6 HR, 4 BB 441/467/617, 1.083 OPS
RH--3.6 2b, 1.2 3b, 0.5 HR, 7 BB 457/497/530, 1.027 OPS
3rd in MVP Voting.

Current 1927 Jamieson, 2.56m, CLE, Bats-L, 5R Balance, LF-1(0)e9
LH—0 2b, 0 3b, 0 HR, 6 BB 216/274/216, .490 OPS
RH--4.9 2b, 1.5 3b, 0 HR, 16 BB 391/492/478, .970 OPS

Current 1925 Jamieson, 2.50m, CLE, Bats-L, E Balance, LF/CF/RF-2(0)e12
LH--2.7 2b, 0.4 3b, 0.5 HR, 14 BB 332/425/386, .811 OPS
RH—2.9 2b, 0.4 3b, 0.5 HR, 14 BB 342/434/398, .832 OPS

He’d be an improvement and was a lifetime .300 hitter. He already has 3 cards. 1923 is more hitting and OBP, 1924 has less OBP but more XBH.






1935 Hank Leiber, NYG, Bats-R, E Balance, LF-2(+1)e13, RF-3(+1)e13, CF-4(+1)e13, 3 Game INJ Risk
LH-- 6.6 2b, 0.3 3b, 4.1 HR, 7 BB 395/439/589, 1.028 OPS
RH-- 6.4 2b, 0.3 3b, 4.1 HR, 7 BB 388/433/579, 1.012 OPS

1939 Hank Leiber, CHC, Bats-R, 1L Balance, LF-2(+1)e9, RF-3(+1)e9, CF-4(+1)e9, 15 Game INJ Risk
LH— 3.3 2b, 0 3b, 11.3 HR, 20 BB 399/516/824, 1.340 OPS
RH—3 2b, 0 3b, 10.2 HR, 20 BB 367/490/753, 1.243 OPS

Current 1938 Leiber, 2.53m, NYG, Bats-R, 5L Balance, LF-2(0)e7, RF/CF-3(0)e7, 2 INJ Rating
LH--4.9 2b, 3.5 3b, 5 HR, 12 BB 404/470/684, OPS
RH--5.1 2b, 0.3 3b, 4.8 HR, 7 BB, 212/263/409, OPS

The 1935 is balanced, but doesn’t seem like much of an upgrade in total. 1939 is an outlier for his career power numbers. Not terrible, not terribly exciting either.






1922 Irish Meusel, NYG, Bats-R, E Balance, LF-2(0)e6, RF/CF-4(0)e6, 3 Game INJ Risk
4.35 4.25 3.00 3 1 0.376 0.399 0.586 0.985
4.20 4.00 3.00 3 1 0.368 0.392 0.572 0.964

1925 Irish Meusel, NYG, Bats-R, E Balance, LF-2(0)e13, RF/CF-4(0)e13, 15 Game INJ Risk
LH—8.00 1.75 5.50 2 1 0.381 0.398 0.648 1.046
RH--7.80 1.75 5.50 2 1 0.374 0.392 0.639 1.031

Current 1921 Irish Meusel, 5.12m, NYG, Bats-R, E Balance, LF-2(0)e10, RF/CF-4(0)e10, 3 Game INJ Risk
LH--6.4 2b, 3 3b, 3 HR, 4 BB 422/449/630, 1.079 OPS
RH--6.2 2b, 3 3b, 3 HR, 4 BB 415/442/620, 1.062 OPS

We obviously already have the best Irish Meusel in the set.






1921 Bob Meusel, NYY, Bats-R, E Balance, RF-3(-4)e20, 3 Game INJ Risk
LH--7.8 2b, 4 3b, 4.7 HR, 2 BB 360/377/644, 1.022 OPS
RH--7.6 2b, 3.8 3b, 4.7 HR, 2 BB 350/369/629, .997 OPS

1925 Bob Meusel, NYY, Bats-R, E Balance, LF-1(-4)e5, RF-2(-4)e5, CF-4(-4)e5, 3b-4e27, 3 Game INJ Risk
LH--5.1 2b, 2.5 3b, 10.2 HR, 7 BB 316/366/723, 1.089 OPS
RH--5.1 2b, 2.5 3b, 10.0 HR, 7 BB 311/362/712, 1.074 OPS
Led League in Home Runs and RBI.

Current 1927 Meusel, 6.03m, NYY, Bats-R, E Balance, RF/LF-1(-5)e11, *2-5/-(18-13), 15 Game INJ Risk
LH--17.1 2b, 2.4 3b, 0.5 HR, 7 BB 390/435/624, 1.059 OPS
RH--10 2b, 2 3b, 2.3 HR, 8 BB 395/445/605, 1.050 OPS

Played in 6 World Series for 1920s Yankees. The 1921 card isn’t as good as the 1927 card, but check out the power in 1925. Meusel was 4th in Home Runs hit in the decade of the 1920s, surpassed only by Ruth, Ken Williams, and Cy Williams. That 1925 card looks like fun for some power, though his OBP is much better in 1927.







1935 Pete Fox, DET, Bats-R, E Balance, RF-2(-1)e4, LF/CF-3(-1)e4
LH--8.6 2b, 2 3b, 4.7 HR, 6 BB 394/433/658, 1.092 OPS
RH--8.5 2b, 1.8 3b, 5.2 HR, 6 BB 396/435/670, 1.105 OPS

1937 Pete Fox, DET, Bats-R, E Balance, RF-2(-1)e8, LF/CF-3(-1)e8
LH--6.6 2b, 1.5 3b, 2.2 HR, 2 BB 399/416/553, .969 OPS
RH--6.6 2b, 1.3 3b, 2.2 HR, 2 BB 391/408/540, .948 OPS

Current 1939 Fox, 1.77m, DET, Bats-R, E Balance, RF-2(-1)e9, LF/CF-3(-1)e9, Steal: *4-6,12/-(18-13) 15 Game INJ Risk
LH--4.1 2b, 1.2 3b, 0.5 HR, 2 BB 326/345/402, .747 OPS
RH--4.1 2b, 1.2 3b, 0.5 HR, 2 BB 320/339/396, .733 OPS

1935 card would be an improvement, helped lead Tigers to World Series title.





1938 Ival Goodman, CIN, Bats-L, 1R Balance, RF-2(-2)e4, 3 Game INJ Risk
LH--5.1 2b, 0 3b, 12.6 HR, 8 BB 287/373/738, 1.111 OPS
RH--5.3 2b, 2.8 3b, 9.8 HR, 7 BB 353/425/773, 1.198 OPS

1939 Ival Goodman, CIN, Bats-L, 1R Balance, LF/RF-2(0)e6, CF-3(0)e6, 15 Game INJ Risk
LH--8.4 2b, 5 3b, 1.8 HR, 12 BB 341/420/589, 1.009 OPS
RH-- 9.6 2b, 5.8 3b, 2 HR, 12 BB 389/463/676, 1.139 OPS

Current 1937 Goodman, 2.99m, CIN, Bats-L, 1R Balance, LF/RF-2(0)e7, CF-3(0)e7, 3 Game INJ Risk
LH--3.8 2b, 3 3b, 3.3 HR, 10 BB 284/357/487, .844 OPS
RH--4.2 2b, 3.4 3b, 3.5 HR, 10 BB 307/378/528, .906 OPS

Got one improvement to hit for power, the other for a little more OBP & AVG. Think I like 1938 better.





1925 Max Carey, PIT, Bats-S, E Balance, RF-1(-2)e23, CF/LF-2(-2)e23, Steal: *3-6/- (19-15)
LH—7.8 2b, 3 3b, 0.8 HR, 14 BB 426/506/598, 1.103 OPS
RH—8 2b, 3.3 3b, 0.8 HR, 14 BB 440/518/622, 1.140 OPS
Led League in Steals. 11th in MVP Voting.

Current 1922 Carey, 7.99m, PIT, Bats-S, 1R Balance, rf-1(-2)e10, CF/LF-2(-2)e10, Steal: *3-6/- (19-15)
LH--3.2 2b, 1.8 3b, 4.3 HR, 15 BB 382/473/593, .1.066 OPS
RH--3.8 2b, 2.3 3b, 4.5 HR, 15 BB 447/529/684, 1.213 OPS
Led League in Steals.

Is he better than the current 1922 card? Not really. Slightly better against LHP, but defense is rough.
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BDWard

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Re: Pre War Outfielders-- Improvement Edition

PostFri Apr 26, 2019 3:15 pm

1930 Carl Reynolds, White Sox, RF/LF 2(-1)e12, CF 3. Bats R .359/.388/.584/.973 with 16 SBs, 22 HRs and 104 RBI, with career highs in PA, H, R, BA, TR (18!), HR, RBI, OBP, SLG, OPS, OPS+ & TB. Only Sox legends Luke Appling, Shoeless Joe Jackson and Eddie Collins (twice) had a higher single season BA for the White Sox. Reynolds had blazing speed and was considered among the best OFers in the game, but was slowed by injuries after 1930. HOFer Al Simmons played for the Sox from 1933-35, but Reynolds' 1930 season was better than any of the 3 by Simmons. Reynolds finished his 13 year big league career with a .302 career BA. He has just one lousy $1.34 mil card with the 1934 Red Sox.
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