Team Strategy. Relief Usage.

Discuss different strategies for any of our player sets
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Chris Franco

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Team Strategy. Relief Usage.

PostTue Jun 06, 2017 5:42 pm

If I set relief Usage to conservative...what does that mean?
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davesquare3

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Re: Team Strategy. Relief Usage.

PostWed Jun 07, 2017 11:03 am

I think it means that computer manager will be less likely to turn to the bullpen. Like say if you starter is in a jam computer manager will let him work out of it. Or if your starter is tired computer manager will let him go 1 more inning
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Hittmens

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Re: Team Strategy. Relief Usage.

PostWed Jun 07, 2017 1:05 pm

davesquare3 wrote:I think it means that computer manager will be less likely to turn to the bullpen. Like say if you starter is in a jam computer manager will let him work out of it. Or if your starter is tired computer manager will let him go 1 more inning

I think Dave is right but also I think it might stay with a reliever longer for example a righty specialist may stay in to face lefties
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Chris Franco

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Re: Team Strategy. Relief Usage.

PostThu Jun 08, 2017 9:05 am

This is what I was afraid of.
I want my starters to get a long leash.
I want my relievers to get pulled quickly.

My four * starters are all $3M to $4M.
Pitchers ballpark.
I've got it set to conservative relief under team settings.
I have my starters set to F8 and have left quick hook and slow hook blank.
So that seems to be working.

But my relievers are being left in too long.
I have them all set to quick hook and I have 2 righty specialists set and 2 lefty specialists set.
With this set up Hal is doing what I want with the starters...
But when the game goes to my bullpen...(All six of them around $1M or so)...they get destroyed. Left in too long.

Suggestions?

Maybe this money allocation is just a bad idea.

($80M league. $22M allocated to pitching staff)

?
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Hittmens

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Re: Team Strategy. Relief Usage.

PostThu Jun 08, 2017 10:19 am

Having your starters set to f8 means they shouldn't be pulled before they get fatigued, so that kind of overrides your bullpen settings. I think having bullpen set to conservative and the relievers quick hook is confusing. I would try just setting bullpen to normal. Also with this kind of team I prefer to have one stud reliever.
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tmfw30

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Re: Team Strategy. Relief Usage.

PostThu Jun 08, 2017 2:50 pm

I agree. Your "do not relieve before F8" trumps the team strategy setting, so you can safely set your relief usage to "normal" or "aggressive" without fear of your starters being pulled.
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sociophil

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Re: Team Strategy. Relief Usage.

PostSun Jun 11, 2017 8:37 pm

Set your relievers to quick hook.
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Chris Franco

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Re: Team Strategy. Relief Usage.

PostThu Jun 15, 2017 1:54 pm

davesquare3 wrote:I think it means that computer manager will be less likely to turn to the bullpen. Like say if you starter is in a jam computer manager will let him work out of it. Or if your starter is tired computer manager will let him go 1 more inning


Yes. Experimented recently with different settings with a team that is playing horribly. Nothing to lose.
And I can say...this is definitely true.
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Chris Franco

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Re: Team Strategy. Relief Usage.

PostThu Jun 15, 2017 1:58 pm

Hittmens wrote:Having your starters set to f8 means they shouldn't be pulled before they get fatigued, so that kind of overrides your bullpen settings.


Conservative setting definitely leaves starters in longer. Less likely Hal will pinch hit for them.

Tried normal and F8...hal pinch hit for starting pitchers earlier IMHO.
Conservative and F8...hal less likely to pinch hit for starting pitchers in a close game.
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the ghost of roger maris

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Re: Team Strategy. Relief Usage.

PostWed Jul 26, 2017 8:27 pm

I found these posts to be helpful .


Questions and answers on bullpen
Postby MARCPELLETIER » Sat Jun 19, 2010 1:09 am

[b:41cbb7b33d]What is the ideal bullpen?[/b:41cbb7b33d]

The CONCEPTUAL response is easy: you need to buy as much, and no more than, the number of critical innings you need from your bullpen. But determining, on a practical level, how many critical innings you'll need from your bullpen is no easy response and depends on your stadium, on the quality of the rotation, and of course on the type of league 200M vs 60M. By critical inning, I mean an inning where the game is on the line.

But there are rough guidelines:
1- your best reliever should ALWAYS be your first set-up man. If he has good closer ability, then he should ALSO be your closer.
2- Your best relievers should NEVER throw in mop-up situations.
3- Your worst relievers should ONLY pitch in mop-up situations. To me, throwing in the 4th inning is NOT a mop-up situation, unless your team is behind by 10 runs!!
4- Specialists (extreme 9L/9R) are really nice options, especially if you can have them cheap, but make sure your bullpen is deep enough. My own zone of confort is: no more than 2 with a regular usage of bullpen; up to 4 if I don't need a deep bullpen (say, if my starting rotation is really strong), or if I have a deep bullpen (say, going with 12 pitchers).

[b:41cbb7b33d]Should I use F-ratings for my relievers?[/b:41cbb7b33d]
The F-levels are a tool to force Hal to leave the reliever on the mound at least until he reaches the fatigue level that you have predetermined. At F-8, the reliever starts to get tired. At F-0, he's completely worn out.

In my experience, a pitcher at F-0 becomes pretty bad. No one knows for sure how the formulas work, but there is definitve evidence that with low F-levels, the dice fall on the offensive cards much more often.

So the settings are to be used for your best pitchers, to make sure that Hal uses them to the full extent of their strenghth, but be careful to not choose a too-low F-level.

Actually, even if you select a high F-rating, say F7, it can lead to danger. Basically, by selecting F7, you tell HAL to not "think" about removing the pitcher before he reaches F7, but this does not mean it will remove the pitcher then, particularly if you have also selected "slow hook" or "conservative use of bullpen". In such settings, HAL will remove the pitcher only if he gets into deep trouble, unless perhaps you have a 1-run lead down the 7th or 8th inning, in which case HAL will follow your bullpen instructions.


[b:41cbb7b33d]If so, why do you suggest to use "quick hook" as well ?[/b:41cbb7b33d]
For my taste, Hal is always too patient with such instructions, particularly considering that I always have at least one good reliever in the bullpen. So the settings I preferred most for my best pitchers is to use a high F-rating, say F7 or F6, but set the pitcher on "quick hook". This way, Hal almost automatically removes the pitcher as soon as he reaches the F-state I defined, and does not allow the pitcher to get as much in trouble as with more conservative ratings., and I do so particularly when my team has deeper bullpen.

[b:41cbb7b33d]
When should I let my closer come in?[/b:41cbb7b33d]
For a R1/C6, I typically use "do not use before the 7th inning" , and I make sure to forsee the possibilty that he gets tired before the 9th inning by having a second reliever with closer ability. In playoff games, I will sometimes change this to "not use before the 8th inning" for home games, particularly with a rested bullpen.

[b:41cbb7b33d]Do I set my best set-up men to "do not use before 6th inning" and "do not use in blowouts"?[/b:41cbb7b33d]
No to the first question: your best set-up man is your bridge to your closer so you want them early if the game is tight. In fact, I like to use the best set-up man not being a closer with the first role in the middle innings, backed-up by my #3 reliever. I also like to assign to my #3 reliever the first role of mop-up, so that he's the one assigned to come early, when there is still a chance of a comeback. So I keep the "do not use in blowouts" only for my best set-up man and my closer.


[b:41cbb7b33d]Do I use "Max IP 1-2 IP"?[/b:41cbb7b33d]
I never use this setting except for specialists (anything close to 9L/9R).

I never use the MAX 2-3 IP, except in leagues with gentleman's rules for bullpen usage (and even then, I would rather prefer to have my best reliever set at 1-2 IP against weak teams, and let them free against the best teams or divisional rivals).

[b:41cbb7b33d]Do I not even use items like "tied and late" "tied and 9th plus" and "behind and late"?[/b:41cbb7b33d]

yes, i always use them. I put there my best relievers. perhaps 1-my best 2-my second best for tied games both late and 9th, and 1-second best and 2-my third best for behind and late

[b:41cbb7b33d]If I don't use any F levels for my starting rotation, should I still leave them on "Quick Hook"?[/b:41cbb7b33d]
It depends on the quality of your starting pitchers, but quick hook with NO F-level will make your starting pitchers go on average 5-6 innings, with some hooks as early as the 4th inning if you set your bullpen as aggressive (in the strategy section). With starters set on quick hook and the strategy section set at "conservative bullpen usage", you should expect the same number of innings than on normal hook, but Hal will manage your bullpen differently (more patient on the conservative usage; quicker on normal settings). Quick hook plus F8 will give you an average of 7 innings per starter. These are all roughly estimated.
[b:41cbb7b33d]
What about maximizing closer?[/b:41cbb7b33d]
As for maximize closer, I am hesitant with your team to use it. Basically, the most impact is what happens in games you lead by 3 runs. Without maximizing, the computer will probably start the 9th inning with whoever pitched the 8th, which in my case is often the best-set-up-man-not-being-a-closer. If you maximize, then the computer will go with your closer.


So, you might ask, what's up with the C6; if the closer situation can't arise earlier than the 9th inning, why does the guy need six outs? That brings us to the other part of the rule, which is this: If the pitcher is already in the game, and it becomes a closer situation, the number of outs that he has already recorded in the game is subtracted from his C number. So a C6 is in good position to get 2-inning saves (note to younger players: this is something that actually used to happen.) He comes into the 8th; gets his three outs; the game becomes a closer situation in the 9th; the three outs are subtracted from his C6; he is still C3 and thus able to close out the 9th

http://forum.365.strat-o-matic.com/arch ... 1&t=613465

But in my experience, this maximizing option will have no impact in games you lead by one, because then the computer will go with your closer no matter what.

In my opinion, with a 3-run lead, I prefer to have my second or third best reliever finish the game, rather than see my best reliever being used for one inning and not being fresh or available for the next game.
vivan Correcaminos! Andale! Andale!

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